GP30s Compared

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  • OTTODAD
    1
    • Feb 2001
    • 32344
    • England
    • General

    #1

    GP30s Compared

    ...
    Last edited by OTTODAD; 03-12-2015, 18:57.
  • baldwin
    6000 Post Veteran


    • Nov 1999
    • 6358
    • Chippenham, Wiltshire, UK.
    • ORTS

    #2
    I think the ORTS status of the Deko geeps is the 3D cab which MSTS does not support. There are several items in an eng file that can be ORTS specific, but they are all prefixed by ORTS as in ORTSadhesion for instance.
    Beer is not a matter of life or death, it is much more serious than that.

    Comment

    • plainsman
      3000 Post Veteran
      • Nov 1999
      • 3011
      • near Jacksonville, TX

      #3
      The Columbus GP30 setting you show look about like what I used in my V4.2 files which I didn't upload, the older V4.1 files may be in te library somewhere? The V4.2 values reflect about 2002 knowledge. The DekoSoft file appears to be from an old GP35 file, the assigned values fit a GP35 for power and continuous tractive effort. The MaxCurrent value is too low, and may cause a problem, it may cause the OR file to reduce power too soon? Neither file really reflects the more recent .eng files in use, especially as to braking characteristics. I don't know if OR uses all the old MSTS brake settings anyway?
      BTW Baldwin, Matej just posted that the ORTSadhesion line isn't operative now in OR. I wondered why I could not get locomotives to work properly when I adjusted the line.
      sigpic

      Comment

      • kraus
        1000 Post Veteran

        • Jan 2001
        • 1086
        • Madison, Wisconsin
        • General

        #4
        Dekosoft placed their common files in a separate download file instead of including them with the locomotive installer.

        GP30 Pro Common Files


        I had a similar problem with a locomotive from Jointed Rail where not all of the required files were bundled together.

        Comment

        • eolesen
          9500 Post Veteran and Administrator



          • Dec 2002
          • 9583
          • NS MP245.4 CNO&TP South District
          • English, SQL
          • General

          #5
          It's covered in the instructions...




          You can't hold the vendor responsible for you not reading the instructions...
          Last edited by eric; 03-12-2015, 08:42.
          If you like what you see here at Trainsim.com, be it the discussions and knowledge in the forums, or items available in our library, I hope you'll consider a paid membership to help support keeping the site operating.... Thanks!

          Comment

          • plainsman
            3000 Post Veteran
            • Nov 1999
            • 3011
            • near Jacksonville, TX

            #6
            Otto, if you have a different path than the expected, installers frequently mess up things like common cab files. You may have to open to a known location and move the files into the correct folder yourself if you have OR and MSTS in a K drive or behind C:\program files (x86)\trainsims\OR.
            Don't be too hard on Chip. We are all trying to wrap our heads around the new sim, and the manual is only clear to those who wrote it. There are still lots of things that were not considered in the excitement to write new ways to approach a problem, and I am sure Chip is struggling to get the neat things he wants to show off, compatible with a moving target in other areas. Once we understand what is and isn't working in OR, we can write better files than the ones above, but all will work OK for just watching a pretty model run.
            sigpic

            Comment

            • baldwin
              6000 Post Veteran


              • Nov 1999
              • 6358
              • Chippenham, Wiltshire, UK.
              • ORTS

              #7
              Hi Bob
              I just read that over at Elvas. What I do know is working are the adhesion adjustment sliders on the Experimental page of options. With the settings I use I can certainly generate wheelslip in inclement weather.
              Beer is not a matter of life or death, it is much more serious than that.

              Comment

              • plainsman
                3000 Post Veteran
                • Nov 1999
                • 3011
                • near Jacksonville, TX

                #8
                Hi Baldwin,
                I know you can play with the sliders and and adjust adhesion in some artistic way, but that totally defeats what I want to be able to do. If I want to be able to instruct and teach someone the difference in a locomotive with an A1A truck and a C truck, or the difference modern autosanding and computer traction control system makes, I can't do that with a default, and I can't do it by saying here now I will move the slider. I need to be able to quantify and replicate values. As it is implemented right now, the program shaves about 30% off the tractive effort of a ES44AC . The only way around that is to make the unit about 30-40% heavier, which then makes other things go very wrong. At this point I am very disappointed in the diesel model, I think the steam model has seen a LOT more work and discussion. I don't argue with Matej's knowledge, but he hasn't been very collaborative in creating a flexible implementation that will model all the things out there, including 1950 DSR 6 4 1500 Baldwins and SD70ACe.
                sigpic

                Comment

                • eolesen
                  9500 Post Veteran and Administrator



                  • Dec 2002
                  • 9583
                  • NS MP245.4 CNO&TP South District
                  • English, SQL
                  • General

                  #9
                  Our friend Vince would put a little more bluntly, but RTFM (read the "free" manual??).

                  Originally posted by OTTODAD


                  Thanks for the link and after downloading it can not unzip it, being asked for a password.

                  Enough is enough !

                  Not another word from me on the subject of Dekosoft !

                  I even included a screenshot above, and it clearly says use the password in your trainset folder.

                  If you can't follow the written instructions, don't complain.
                  If you like what you see here at Trainsim.com, be it the discussions and knowledge in the forums, or items available in our library, I hope you'll consider a paid membership to help support keeping the site operating.... Thanks!

                  Comment

                  • baldwin
                    6000 Post Veteran


                    • Nov 1999
                    • 6358
                    • Chippenham, Wiltshire, UK.
                    • ORTS

                    #10
                    Originally posted by plainsman
                    Hi Baldwin,
                    I know you can play with the sliders and and adjust adhesion in some artistic way, but that totally defeats what I want to be able to do. If I want to be able to instruct and teach someone the difference in a locomotive with an A1A truck and a C truck, or the difference modern autosanding and computer traction control system makes, I can't do that with a default, and I can't do it by saying here now I will move the slider. I need to be able to quantify and replicate values. As it is implemented right now, the program shaves about 30% off the tractive effort of a ES44AC . The only way around that is to make the unit about 30-40% heavier, which then makes other things go very wrong. At this point I am very disappointed in the diesel model, I think the steam model has seen a LOT more work and discussion. I don't argue with Matej's knowledge, but he hasn't been very collaborative in creating a flexible implementation that will model all the things out there, including 1950 DSR 6 4 1500 Baldwins and SD70ACe.
                    I know what it is you want to do, and something like that is needed. I agree that the "sliders" are not the best thing around, but it is all we have. The steam model was developed from the ground up and owes nothing to the original MSTS apart from using some of the parameters. The extant adhesion model does not suit them either. What we need are a total rewrite of the diesel code and the adhesion module, but neither is coming any time soon, unfortunately.
                    Beer is not a matter of life or death, it is much more serious than that.

                    Comment

                    • crstagg
                      4500 Post Veteran


                      • Nov 1999
                      • 4885
                      • Huntsville, AL
                      • Texan
                      • MSOR

                      #11
                      Originally posted by OTTODAD


                      Thanks for the link and after downloading it can not unzip it, being asked for a password.

                      Enough is enough !

                      Not another word from me on the subject of Dekosoft !

                      From http://www.dekosoft.com/trains/?p=172 reached from Dekosoft main page of http://www.dekosoft.com/trains/ by clicking "GP30 Pro Edition Common Files"

                      Custom engine and cab view sounds required for the GP30 Pro Edition sets.
                      GP30 Pro Common Files (v.1.0) 17.9MB

                      Note: You can find the password for this file in the trainset folder of your installed GP30 Pro set.


                      If you still cannot find the password Otto, email or PM me and I will send it to you.
                      Charles

                      Comment

                      • crstagg
                        4500 Post Veteran


                        • Nov 1999
                        • 4885
                        • Huntsville, AL
                        • Texan
                        • MSOR

                        #12
                        Columbus GP-30 cabview is the Default Kuju Impression of a GP cab. Look at the CLW GP30 Cabview folder it has GP38.cvf dated 2001.

                        Go to http://www.dpdproductions.com/photos..._radio/127.jpg and see what a GP38 cab really looks like. Not at all what Kuju created.

                        There is a video tour of a GP30 cab here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EpxGlAAqL4I

                        Have you tried the Dekosoft's 3dCabs?

                        Here they are:





                        No I'm not crazy. I was responding to this post of Otto's where he was comparing the Cab of the CLW GP-30 to Dekosoft's.

                        "Thanks, Charles !

                        I have seen it after installing the Deko GP-30 and wondered what it was for, not being aware then that it was needed to un-zip that update.

                        In any case, usually not driving locos from inside their cabs, the Dekosoft cabview shows even less of the track ahead than the Columbus version !"
                        Last edited by crstagg; 03-12-2015, 19:11.
                        Charles

                        Comment

                        • crstagg
                          4500 Post Veteran


                          • Nov 1999
                          • 4885
                          • Huntsville, AL
                          • Texan
                          • MSOR

                          #13
                          Originally posted by OTTODAD
                          Test running my 4-GP30+100-wagons+4-GP30 consist and not being a route builder, it would appear that this level crossing can not be set to work properly with trains of varying lengths ?
                          Other than GP 30s and not even Dekosoft GP 30 as the power on the train what do those 2 pictures have to do with the Subject of the thread?
                          Charles

                          Comment

                          • crstagg
                            4500 Post Veteran


                            • Nov 1999
                            • 4885
                            • Huntsville, AL
                            • Texan
                            • MSOR

                            #14
                            Otto,

                            Check out this video and see how little a Southern RR engineer could see from the cab of a GP30, About half way thru the video the photographer gets in the cab.
                            Charles

                            Comment

                            • conductorchris
                              2500 Post Veteran

                              • Mar 2010
                              • 2905
                              • Vermont
                              • General

                              #15
                              I have been in the cab of GP30's. Dekosoft has the look about right. Except no engine I've ever been in was anything even halfway as clean! The B&O GP30's I rode had a lighter green interior paint. Not seen in these pictures is the very distinctive lines of the interior ceiling which match the exterior profile.
                              Christopher

                              Comment

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