Problems with train crossings on single track routes

[213 001-1]

Dear railway friends!

When I'm working on my activity packages, I also want to add train crossings to single-track routes. To do this, I first added a blind train, as I did with the MSTS. I don't know if that's the English term. In German, a blind train is the name given to the invisible vehicle that serves to temporarily block the player train's route. Then I added the oncoming AI train. In the MSTS activity editor, the train crossing works perfectly, but there's a problem in the OR. The blind train blocks the player train's path for as long as it should, but the oncoming AI train doesn't appear at all. It's as if I hadn't added an AI train, but it is.

Can anyone explain to me why that might be?

Thank you in advance for your answers.

[joe_star]

Hello.

While I have not delved deep into it, I believe OR has improved deadlock processing vs msts and such scenarios as above can be properly resolved using "passing paths" rather than having to resort to dummy trains.

https://open-rails.readthedocs.io/en/latest/operation.html

Refer to sections 11.1 & 11.5, and I am sure others here will be able to provide examples if necessary

[oper190]

Regarding the AI traffic trains - as I have experienced - Do to the physics changes made with OR many MSTS engine do not preform as well in OR as they did in MSTS. Thus the AI train may well be running slower than it did in MSTS and so would arrive at the location later.
Without updating my MSTS eng files, I find needing to nearly double the engine power to get the same performance in OR as in MSTS.

[crstagg]

Regarding the AI traffic trains - as I have experienced - Do to the physics changes made with OR many MSTS engine do not preform as well in OR as they did in MSTS. Thus the AI train may well be running slower than it did in MSTS and so would arrive at the location later.
Without updating my MSTS eng files, I find needing to nearly double the engine power to get the same performance in OR as in MSTS.

That could be caused by using the freeware version of ConBuilder to edit consists. The freeware version did not calculate the Consist parameter MaxVelocity. Instead, it defaulted an entry of "MaxVelocity ( 40.000 1.00000 )". Where as the MSTS CE and the Payware version of ConBuilder would calculate the MaxVelocity and enter something like "MaxVelocity ( 31.73984 0.64289 )"

MSTS uses the MaxVelocity parameter to control AI consists. I was told by the ORTS developers that ORTS does not use the value.

FYI the Freeware version of ConBuilder did provide the user with an option to manually enter the values for MaxVelocity. But few knew of this because "No one reads the manual".

[derekmorton]

Just to correct an incorrect statement,
The AI activity runner does not honour the physics code, it branches out when an AI is run.
This does not mean that MSTS and OR AI code is the same.

You will however notice differences in the player performance.

MSTS by default had player running at %130 of adhesion.
OR can be adjusted back to 100%

[213 001-1]

Well, i tried to use the function, which is called in German "Durchfahrtroute beginnen", what means in English "Start transit route" and i hope, this is, what's called in the manual passing path.


I used it only for the AI train as well as only for the player train and also for both, but unfortunately nothing of it worked. Every time, the AI train stops in front of the entry signal of the railway station.

[crstagg]

Probably because your "Blind train" is occupying the block.

[213 001-1]

In this case, i didn't use a blind train at all.

[R. Steele]

In your first post you wrote "activity packages" --- are you making Activities or working on a Timetable?

[213 001-1]

In your first post you wrote "activity packages" --- are you making Activities or working on a Timetable?

I build activity packages in the classical way like in the MSTS back then.

[timetable57]

The AI train, both in MSTS and OR should start before the beginning of the activity. You can put a waiting point (not a blind train) some miles before the crossing station calculating a correct time for crossing. E.G. Activity starts at 8:00. and you want to cross the AI at 9:00. Make the AI train leaving at 7:50 and stop at the way point untill 8:50. This is what I do

[l.k.]

Have you tried using waiting points to coordinate the meet? Open Rails offers some advanced options for waiting points that are very useful when trying to overcome "deadlocks".

If I understand it right, the player train arrives at the station first and has to wait there for the oncoming AI train.This is what has worked for me in such cases:

Open the path of the player train in Open Rails Track Viewer. Right-click on the player path in front of the exit signal (Ausfahrsignal) of the meeting station and place a waiting point there. Open Rails allows you to define the exact time until witch the train has to wait (using the 24h clock). Put the planned arrival time of the AI train in there (e.g. if the AI train arrives at 14:00 at the meeting station, put a wait until14:00 into the waiting point definition in track viewer). Now the exit signal for the player train should remain red and the single track beyond it free to use for the AI train until it has arrived at the station as well. No need to use "Blind" trains anymore...

This also works the other way around, when AI trains prematurely occupy parts of tracks the player train needs to use first (which happens quite a lot in original MSTS activities supplied with Pro Train routes, causing unnecessary delays): Just place a exactly defined waiting point for the AI train at a suitable location and everything should work as intended. A lot of non working activities that were written for MSTS can be fixed with the clever use of waiting points.

(Of course the AI train needs to have a path that uses a different track at the meeting point than the player train...).

Sadly I'm not at my Open Rails machine at the moment, so I can't make any screenshots to show the process more clearly. Perhaps I can try to put in a more comprehensive illustrated explanation at the weekend, if it's still unclear then...

Hope you get it to work! In most cases Open Rails is a lot more straightforward than MSTS ever was. But sometimes this means "unlearning" the complicated workarounds we had to do to get MSTS to work...

Also: You should try out timetable mode sometime. It's a lot of fun, when you start to get to grips with it. You can define whole traffic patterns quite easily - and every train can be driven by the player. 🙂

[213 001-1]

Thank you for your tip about the Track Viewer program. The program offers great possibilities. I still have one question. Now that I have set the waiting point for the player train directly in front of the exit signal and set the time until the oncoming train should arrive at the station, at what time and how far before the station's entry signal should the AI train start?

[l.k.]

It should not really matter when and where the AI train starts as long as it's arriving at the meeting point roughly at the right time.

I mostly use real life timetables when building activities and tend to use the previous scheduled stop of the AI train as it's starting point. Then I can use it's departure time from this previous station as it's start time and don't have to figure out all the timings myself. Why not use, what works in real life?

[213 001-1]

Thanks again. How can you set the exact arrival and departure times for AI trains? I only know the program Activity Cahnger, in which you can only set the arrival and departure times of the player trains.