trouble installing Conbuilder.

[agentatascadero]

So, my adventure begins. I've replaced the old XP machine with a Windows10 version.
My plan is to run both MSTS and OR, while using the Raildriver controls.
So far, I'm having nothing but trouble with installation. The RD works with OR but not MSTS.

On the old computer, I found Conbuilder absolutely essential to satisfaction with the sim. I'd never be happy with stock equipment. I am foiled at step ONE of the installation process....where I am instructed to right click, go to properties, and click on the compatibility tab. The problem for me is that when I click on properties, there is no compatibility tab present.

I'm probably doing something wrong, but feel I am following instructions exactly, but not obtaining the predicted results.


There is another big problem as well......apparently Windows10 does not like certain items I'm trying to install to the sim, and so it blocks me. I've got the computer set to run in administrator mode, but that does not accomplish what is needed.

Here's hoping there are answers out there.

AA

[R. Steele]

For the ConBuilder problem...Charles may see this...otherwise, post something on the ConBuilder Forum. I am running ConBuilder on Win10, no problems.

As an alternative to ConBuilder...try Goku's TSRE that has a very good consist editor built in...absolutely easy to replace stock in activities, really I rarely use CB much anymore ( all though I still keep it and do like it )

TSRE_CE does not have diagnostic tools...but for those you should try Ged Saunders (slipperman) excellent Act Manager, MSTS Check and SMS Checker...all found here in the library.

[crstagg]

So, my adventure begins. I've replaced the old XP machine with a Windows10 version.
My plan is to run both MSTS and OR, while using the Raildriver controls.
So far, I'm having nothing but trouble with installation. The RD works with OR but not MSTS.

On the old computer, I found Conbuilder absolutely essential to satisfaction with the sim. I'd never be happy with stock equipment. I am foiled at step ONE of the installation process....where I am instructed to right click, go to properties, and click on the compatibility tab. The problem for me is that when I click on properties, there is no compatibility tab present.

I'm probably doing something wrong, but feel I am following instructions exactly, but not obtaining the predicted results.


There is another big problem as well......apparently Windows10 does not like certain items I'm trying to install to the sim, and so it blocks me. I've got the computer set to run in administrator mode, but that does not accomplish what is needed.

Here's hoping there are answers out there.

AA

Questions:
1. Which ConBuilder? Freeware or Payware?
2. Which version?
3. What are you right clicking on? ZIP file? Installer executable (cbmsetup_####.exe)? or Conbuilder.exe?

[EricF]

Conbuilder forums will probably have the best help for that application.

Make sure you don't install MSTS or any typical tools for it (Like Conbuilder, Route Riter, etc.) in any of the "Program Files" folders. Ever since Windows 7, that's been important. Just make folders to install them into, like a "c:\MSTS" folder and a "c:\MSTS Utilities" folder. When you run installers, you'll have to make sure they're putting things into the correct path -- use the "Custom" option or whatever allows you to browse or type in the right paths.

The "blocked" files is a known problem in Windows 7, 8, and 10 with executable files that were originally downloaded on a different computer. You can right-click on the executable and choose "properties", then look on the bottom of the little window when the "General" tab is active. Put a checkmark into the box next to "Unblock", down near the bottom. This typically applies to executable files, which includes installers and self-extracting archive files.


The really complicated part (RailDriver)

RailDriver's utility that "reads" the HUD in MSTS doesn't work in Windows 7, 8, or 10. The method used to do that stopped working under Windows Vista/7 and the RailDriver folks couldn't come up with a replacement. It has to do with how MSTS puts the HUD on the screen versus security measures in modern Windows that keeps malware from using similar tricks to steal things like passwords.

BUT -- RailDriver does work in Open Rails. How well it works depends on the version of ORTS that you're using. And that's the real problem, because various things in Open Rails have been under development in slightly different versions in order to sort out bugs and specific behaviors. It's a little intimidating at the moment if you haven't been following the project closely.

The "Stable" release version 1.3 is actually getting very stale and will be phased out by a 1.4 version. No timeline yet, but it's actively being discussed. 1.3 has rudimentary RailDriver support, but any of the "Unstable"/"Experimental" versions are better.

There is an OR "Ultimate" version by contributor PerpetualKid and an OR "New Year MG" version by Carlo Santucci, both of which are much further along with development and include a completely overhauled and improved RailDriver calibration function along with much more accurate RailDriver control behavior.

If you haven't already, I'd really recommend that you register at Elvas Tower at least for the Open Rails forum section there, so you can read and follow the development discussions. Lots of good information there. The project is very much alive and there's been quite a bit of work done to make the next major update a very successful one. Many familiar faces are over there, and that's the place to report ORTS bugs in a specific section.

[ragtimer]

The latest (free) version of CB is available,I think both here and at UKTrainsim.Follow the instructions CAREFULLY and you will have no problems.I also recently installed the last version of RouteRiter from Steam4ME on a WIN 7 machine (NOT the digital rails version,that is full of traps).Again,follow the instructions CAREFULLY.Both are OK to go in either of the "Programs" folders.Both work fine for me.
I have also found from sheer bitter experience that if you mess up TrainStore,it can be recovered by doing a "system restore" !!

[slipperman]

Hi Peter,
With respect, you are very lucky to get away with using the Program Files / Program Files (x86) folders. Of course, you could be using a very old version of Win 7 which might have less stringent restrictions (but I doubt it!).

To avoid the problem where you make edits to a file and can't for the life of you find where the edited file has gone, I suggest that C:\Program Files and C:\Program Files (x86) are NEVER used for MSTS or any of its associated programs and utilities.

Cheers,
Ged

[rdayt]

Hi Peter,
To avoid the problem where you make edits to a file and can't for the life of you find where the edited file has gone, I suggest that C:\Program Files and C:\Program Files (x86) are NEVER used for MSTS or any of its associated programs and utilities.

Cheers,
Ged

I agree with this 100%.
Anything built for MSTS be it RouteRiter, ConBuilder, not sure about TSM, should be installed outside of any Windows folder. Programs, Desktop, Users will mess with your sanity. Ask me how I know.
Root of the drive is better for finding stuff too. C:\MSTS, C:\Tools, etc.
New stuff like Blender, PaintdotNet, Sketchup, etc can be installed using the default programs folders.
If installed correctly any of these programs will work flawlessly. Even on Windows 10.
Anybody gotten their hands on 11 yet? Whole new can-o-worms
Good luck
Randy

[R. Steele]

Hi Peter,
With respect, you are very lucky to get away with using the Program Files / Program Files (x86) folders. Of course, you could be using a very old version of Win 7 which might have less stringent restrictions (but I doubt it!).

To avoid the problem where you make edits to a file and can't for the life of you find where the edited file has gone, I suggest that C:\Program Files and C:\Program Files (x86) are NEVER used for MSTS or any of its associated programs and utilities.

Cheers,
Ged

Third Vote in agreement with Ged....DO NOT place any MSTS utilities ( even though they may be used for OR ) in either of the two microsoft "Program" folders -- no matter what you may read from other members. ( due respect to their seniority and experience --- times change. )

Similar to what EricF suggested I use a folder named C:\TrainSim_Utilities and everything goes in this folder....this is considered best practice.

[R. Steele]

Anybody gotten their hands on 11 yet? Whole new can-o-worms
Good luck
Randy

WORMS...CANS of THEM!! OMG! There was (RIP) a highly respected and beloved grouchy member here that ate worms. I wonder if he bought them from MS?Can of Worms.jpg

[agentatascadero]

Charles,
The CB version is the one in the Trainsim file section. Freeware. V 2.4.9, the zip file is listed as CB249.
The right click was, as instructed, on the exe file, instruction me to click on the compatibility tab. The problem for me is that there is no compatibility tab visible after the right click.

As instructed at the steam4me site, I have directed all my MSTS and OR installations to C:/xxxxxx, thus avoiding those program file issues, at least I hope that is the case.

AA

[geepster775]

If you try to run it once and it fails, your system (smartscreen thingy?) should prompt you to choose a compatibility mode when you execute setup a second time. No 'old school' right clicking involved. You have to run it, let it fail for outdated installer reasons, and then your system is smart enough to offer you compatibility modes when you run it a second time.


All my tools are in C:\Simulation, my arbitrary name, on the C: drive but away from program files. All my route and rolling stock content is on a different non-system drive ( F:\ )

[agentatascadero]

Erik, It appears you are telling me there is no hope of getting RD to work in Windows10, true?

My OR install is v1.3....are you recommending I install a later version, and, if so, that it will better be able to handle RD?

I think I really have only one issue with the loss of MSTS for the RD, and that is my favorite running position......the heads out view...not just for better viewing, but better, outside sounds too. I suppose there is no hope for a heads out view to be developed in OR?

AA

[crstagg]

Charles,
The CB version is the one in the Trainsim file section. Freeware. V 2.4.9, the zip file is listed as CB249.
The right click was, as instructed, on the exe file, instruction me to click on the compatibility tab. The problem for me is that there is no compatibility tab visible after the right click.

As instructed at the steam4me site, I have directed all my MSTS and OR installations to C:/xxxxxx, thus avoiding those program file issues, at least I hope that is the case.

AA

WHICH EXE file cbmsetup.exe or conbuilder.exe?

[crstagg]

Cannot duplicate. Both cbsetup.exe from 249 and conbuilder.exe display a Compatibility Tab after right clicking and selecting Properties using WIN 10 Pro. Do other EXE file display a Compatibility tab?

[EricF]

Erik, It appears you are telling me there is no hope of getting RD to work in Windows10, true?

That's correct. Ever since Vista/Win7, RailDriver has been unable to work with MSTS. (Specifically MSTS. It works fine with other simulators.)

My OR install is v1.3....are you recommending I install a later version, and, if so, that it will better be able to handle RD?

"Ultimate" version by contributor PerpetualKid is on GitHub:

https://github.com/perpetualKid/ORTS-MG

Carlo Santucci publishes his OR_NewYear_MG version on his download page:

http://www.interazioni-educative.it/Downloads/index.php

Carlo keeps a thread active on Elvas Tower and notifies of updates there.

Both of these versions have the updated, modern support for RailDriver written by PerpetualKid. Calibration and the ability to assign keys to the RailDriver buttons are Open Rails "Options" button menu. They appear on a "RailDriver" tab if you have the RailDriver plugged in before you start up Open Rails. This is a much better implementation of the RailDriver and it's slated to be included in version 1.4, I believe. For now, these versions tend to be highly recommended for RailDriver users.

You can have more than one version of Open Rails installed... BUT... Avoid using the auto-update feature. It may pull the wrong update. Just download and replace the Open Rails folder of the version you want to update.

Remember that saves may not work across different versions or updates.

I think I really have only one issue with the loss of MSTS for the RD, and that is my favorite running position......the heads out view...not just for better viewing, but better, outside sounds too. I suppose there is no hope for a heads out view to be developed in OR?

Key mappings for the camera are different. Default for head-out view is "Home" key for head-out looking forward and "End" key for head-out looking backward. The arrow keys can turn and move the camera more from either starting point.