LIRR Route

[lateagain]

I started this thread here because it seemed odd to me that so far two threads relating to Vince's beta release were both in somewhat obscure (?) MSTS threads

Released as an Open Rails Route I figured that discussion might be focussed here?

The threads involved so far are

https://www.trainsim.com/vbts/showthread.php?326106-Freight-cars-for-the-Long-Island-Railroad&p=1907399#post1907399

..and

https://www.trainsim.com/vbts/showthread.php?326100-LIRR-Route-wont-run&p=1907397#post1907397

A quick run of Vince's new route shows that it cries out for some "State of the Art" rolling stock. The LIRR has a long history and has featured some very interesting stock from the very early electric loco's and Camelbacks through to current unique diesel loco's and double decker coaches.

Stock and Activities are Chicken or Egg issues? Whatever comes first it'll be a keeper as far as I'm concerned

[Don6218]

Just a note, Tiger Trains has an excellent MTA Trainset with P32AC-DM locos and Excellent cars for Open Rails.

Just downloaded it last evening.

[R. Steele]

I posted this in the MSTS LIRR thread, so I'll duplicate it here.
from this thread >>> https://www.trainsim.com/vbts/showth...27#post1907427

...The down side: The pop-up messages have to be responded to with a Mouse Click on Close and resume button which is kinda' hard to do while chugging a beer. Pressing Esc will get you going but leaves the message on the screen. Not only is that annoying but now you won't get any more messages (which sometimes can be useful ) apparently because only one is allowed on screen at a time. regards,

No worries, all those messages can be given the OR parameter "ORTSContinue ( 15 )" - the messages will display for 15seconds while not stopping the activity. Time can be changed to whatever feels appropriate - I like 15 seconds.

See this section in the manual >>> 10.16.1 No Halt by Activity Message Box

or this thread at Elvas >>> http://www.elvastower.com/forums/ind..._1#entry175203

One Warning! using the MSTS AE to open and save the activity will erase all the ORTSContinue lines. The activity can be edited manually using ConText (or other suitable text editor) without removing the ORTSContinue lines.

[lateagain]

Just a note, Tiger Trains has an excellent MTA Trainset with P32AC-DM locos and Excellent cars for Open Rails.

Just downloaded it last evening.

Good that there's stuff for the modern era but the LIRR was (like a lot of roads) much more interesting in the transition era. It's not that there's NO stock.... just not enough and I'm sure that any author would acknowledge that their efforts 10+ years ago are not the same as what's achievable now. Still give it some time....

[R. Steele]

Attached is the Detour Activity modified with the ORTSContinue parameter set to 15 seconds.
The activity can still be paused if so desired. Also it can be Resumed without closing the message box. AFAIK know the box will stay on screen until the next message is scheduled - which will not appear, when there is another message box onscreen. You'll know when that is, because the current message box will also disappear.

06Detour.zip

Vince, I like the #5 "copter" view in the Detour Train.

[dcarleton]

Good that there's stuff for the modern era but the LIRR was (like a lot of roads) much more interesting in the transition era. It's not that there's NO stock.... just not enough and I'm sure that any author would acknowledge that their efforts 10+ years ago are not the same as what's achievable now. Still give it some time....

For now you can use a little poetic licence and remember that the LIRR was once owned by the PRR. It not hard to find PRR stuff from the transition era. Use that until better LIRR stuff comes out.

[Vince]

Attached is the Detour Activity modified with the ORTSContinue parameter set to 15 seconds.....................SNIP.................. ............"

Hi Gerry,
I was experimenting with this. Thanks for pointing this out.
I didn't see your post until just now as I was shutting down for the night.
Some of the messages are short, like; "That's Parkville Yard on the left" for which I used a 5 second display time. But the one about where my daughter was born is ok by me to leave at 15 seconds. So what I am doing is customizing the message display time for the length of the message. This might be a bad thing for release though as I'm a very fast reader and probably your 'default is 15 seconds' is probable a better choice for the general population.

Another thing; When a message is on screen and you pass another message location as at the "Here we pass under the BMT 8th Ave station . . . ." message location just before the X crossovers on the Bay Ridge, there is another message right at the Xovers which is missed at a 15 second display time and may even be too close for a 5 second display time. ( which I haven't had a chance to check yet.) Better yet I'm going to move that MP54 office car message to the return run track where you can better see the car anyway.
Problem solved.
But the 15 second sounds okay. Let's see what the users say about it.

best regards,
vince

[lateagain]

Just a note, Tiger Trains has an excellent MTA Trainset with P32AC-DM locos and Excellent cars for Open Rails.

Just downloaded it last evening.

The coaches look similar to the LIRR's "Push,Pull" stock but I'm guessing that the LIRR has loading gauge issues compared to many lines? This picture of an "incident" (The LIRR seems to have had a lot of "incidents" ) shows just how low their double deck stock and their custom built diesels are compared to the older M1's

http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.2296186.1437186523!/img/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/article_750/lirr18n-6-copy.jpg

Having said that the DM30-ACs seem to be lower than the GP38's the LIRR used?

[rrroberttt]

@R. Steele, Thanks for the revision of the Detour Activity.

[captain82]

Sir Vince. Hats off to you again man. This route is AMAZING and brings back some memories. Thank you again for bringing NY back into the sims.

[pwillard]

What is missing from the roster?

[Vince]

Guys,

The stock included with the route was never meant to be LIRR 'stock'. It's only to avoid hassles uploading other than default. I do that because there are so many preferences as to what runs on a users route I prefer to leave it to them to select and download what they want. Also there is the fact that under Open Rails there are adjustments that need to be made to some stock made me reluctant to deliver stock that would require me to spend additional time testing before release.

I use Otto's K.I.S.S principle, using as few trainsets as possible to run the suite of testing activities. This is also why there is only one fairly complex and one simple freight activity. I spent long hours testing that LILCO Coal activity getting everything to line up properly. If I had decided to do that with all the activities y'all would still be waiting for a route.

Simplicity is the reason the pseudo passenger runs have no stops. They are there to allow the user to 'know the line' they will have to drive when then get trained and start drive REAL passenger trains that look good.
All those passenger run inspection activities are designed to run in Autopilot Mode. This way you can start a run, sit back and watch the 'Training Video. . . . with a cup of your favorite beverage.

'So gentlemen, no problem if you abuse those 15 year old sets of default Series 2000 MU's. I Wouldn't want you folks puttin' scratches and dings in a nice MP-54 model now. The 'training' equipment looks crappy but they do work without tinkering in Open Rails. (i don't like driving them though as the brake operation sucks.)

I didn't want to have to worry if this or that piece of add-on rolling stock had issues with Open Rails AND have to address issues with the route Too! OttO Wipful's SP Express Trainset was meant for comfort, not looks, ease of inspection (that copter view Gerry mentioned) and non-protypical performance that lets me stop quickly to inspect a glitch in the route as we pass by on a run.

Learn the line with the junk stock I've provided and leave the selection of stock to the end user he want's to use on HIS system.
I'm quite sure there will some really nice equipment coming soon now that there is a place to run.

Conductorchris has done some research (thanks Christopher) [URL="https://www.trainsim.com/vbts/showthread.php?326106-Freight-cars-for-the-Long-Island-Railroad&p=1907443#post1907443"]on the proper freight cars for the LIRR[/URL

Me?
On Monday I am going to resume work on the Oyster Bay Branch from where I halted construction at East Williston to get this first small part of the LIRR out of my stuffy old computer to where it could see the light of day and hopefully provide some enjoyment to the community.
On to Oyster Bay. Enjoy!

best regards and Happy Holidays to all,

[lateagain]

Vince,

I, for one, fully understand the reasons for the stock provided at this stage. However whilst you continue with the route development I think you can take it that the fact we're all talking about stock to run on it means we all think this route is a "keeper" . BTW KISS should always be on any designers desk IMO

[bootednancy]

Geoff:

"The coaches look similar to the LIRR's "Push,Pull" stock but I'm guessing that the LIRR has loading gauge issues compared to many lines"

The Tiger Trains set are Bombardier cars, which were COMPLETELY dfferent than the LIRR push-pull cars. The LIRR cars were rebuilt de-motored 1955 built MP-72 class cars. The BBD's came about in the late 1970's, 20 years after the LIRR cars.

The LIRR does have a number of HEIGHT clearance restrictions...NOT loading gauge........due to low overpass bridges on several lines in eastern Long Island, the East River tunnels and Penn Station because of the catenary wires, and the low depth cut tunnels under the surface of Atlantic Avenue on the line to Brooklyn. Infact, the GP-38-2 engines had to be sent back so the air filter box which slightly sticks above the long hood had to be modified with angled instead of the production straight sides because it kept getting bashed on the platform sheds at Jamaica station.

There is a number of earlier LIRR (1950-1960 era) stuff available in the Library...MP-54 cars, MP-70 double deckers, RS-1 and RS-3 locomotives from the rail fan loved "classic" orange/grey era. Also besides some PRR equipment (from the 1940 era) the LI did buy 6 PRR non-air conditioned P-70 coaches in the early 60's. Over time they also leased a number, later purchased 3, Reading coaches of the classic RDG-CNJ Bethlehem Ship Building design, as well as leasing in the late 1960s 3 of the Reading RS-3 engines to suppliment their ailing fleet of Alcos.
\
And yes Geoff....the DM-30's ARE lower than the GP-38's....along with the Bi-levels........BECAUSE the GP-38's were never intenmded to go into Penn Station.the DM-30's (DM is for Dual Mode) which run diesel or 3rd rail electric and bilevels were designed for that to give a "one seat ride" for far east end commuters directly to New York...........so far it is known, the DM-30s and bilevels have not operated into Flatbush Avenue probably because the traffic demand is less there than it is for New York, and the platforms are much shorter than the average length of a trainset going to NY.

Doug

[tf51d]

Good that there's stuff for the modern era but the LIRR was (like a lot of roads) much more interesting in the transition era. It's not that there's NO stock.... just not enough and I'm sure that any author would acknowledge that their efforts 10+ years ago are not the same as what's achievable now. Still give it some time....

If you like old LIRR stock, there is some in the library like an MP54, MP70, some Locos like an ALCO FA1.