Calling all route builders as well as MSTS and OR users

[mnjrr]

Hello,

The members of the Open Rails team have had ongoing discussions about how to make Open Rails an independent simulator free from the requirement of having MSTS installed. Achieving this objective has become more paramount as copies of MSTS are becoming increasingly scarce, as you may know. Bearing in mind the important objective of gaining self-independence for Open Rails, the Open Rails team is currently compiling a list of routes originally created for MSTS that do not have any default content that came with the software. One of the main reasons why we are compiling this list is to help Open Rails users, who do not have access to MSTS, to run be able to run Open Rails without MSTS.

I am calling on route builders, as well as MSTS and OR users, who know of routes that do not use existing default MSTS content, for your help in please providing the Open Rails team with the names of these routes. Please feel free to post the names of these routes in this thread. Once the Open Rails team compiles a list of routes that do not have any default MSTS content, the team will publish this list on our website.This undertaking is one important step in making Open Rails truly an independent simulator.

Thank you for your time and help.

[eric]

How strictly do you want to define default content?... Shapes/textures for scenery? Track shapes?

I've got three routes in various stage of development which have no Kuju objects in the Shapes or Textures. I've got a fourth in advanced beta that I'm close to having removed all the default scenery objects from.

If track is included, did X-Tracks replace all the default track shapes with new shapes?

[wacampbell]

Such a route must also not use any MSTS-provided sounds in the "train simulator" directory nor in the route's local directory.

[OTTODAD]

As far as I know all routes contain MSTS DEFAULT content, tracks, signalling and other MSTS Global items such as sounds.

Many use Distant Mountains, ORTS seems to have a problem displaying.

X-Tracks are still using the basic design of MSTS tracks, using the Global Tsection.dat and even DB-Tracks can be used after re-naming them to X-Tracks.

There are routes which have been created with non-X-Tracks like UK-Finescale and Payware Protrain routes which use DB-Tracks only straight out the box.

O t t o

[lindsayts]

A question, How is the project going over at UKtrainsim to replace all MSTS default objects with freely availible replacements? Maybe its time to make this more wide spread amongst those that can build items.

I have much experience with the image manipulation program "gimp" and am currently making good headway with the 3D program "blender" but have yet to come across a reliable way of exporting the results to the MSTS formats. Has OR consider using an open format for textures and shape files as well as sound files (note 1), this would make things way easier.

Note 1: Formats that existing opensource tools can RELIABLY export to, Blender for instance cannot export to all of its availble formats equally,this appears to be the case with most 3D tools.

Lindsay

[mnjrr]

Hello,

The Open Rails is looking for routes that do not have any default MSTS content for inclusion on the list.

Hello Lindsay,

I have not heard any updates this year thus far about the project to create replacements of the default MSTS content. Notwithstanding the lack of news about the project, the Open Rails team is still very excited about this project as another way to help Open Rails move away from MSTS.

[OTTODAD]

The MSTS CD contains 2083 shape and 378 wav files.

X-Tracks and other tracks creators have added scores more, my GLOBAL\SHAPES folder now containing 9094 tracks and roads.

O t t o

[eric]

Until there's a one-to-one replacement for the Kuju track pieces, I guess I'll have to take my routes off the list for now.

[baldwin]

Such a route must also not use any MSTS-provided sounds in the "train simulator" directory nor in the route's local directory.

Looks like there is a need for someone to make some replacement sounds, but I am not volunteering. I would not know where to begin.

[GoGoran]

A question, How is the project going over at UKtrainsim to replace all MSTS default objects with freely availible replacements? Maybe its time to make this more wide spread amongst those that can build items.

I have much experience with the image manipulation program "gimp" and am currently making good headway with the 3D program "blender" but have yet to come across a reliable way of exporting the results to the MSTS formats. Has OR consider using an open format for textures and shape files as well as sound files (note 1), this would make things way easier.

Note 1: Formats that existing opensource tools can RELIABLY export to, Blender for instance cannot export to all of its availble formats equally,this appears to be the case with most 3D tools.

Lindsay

In the German MSTS scene, ALL default shapes (incl. bridges, trees, shrubs, etc.) have long ago been replaced with 3rd party freeware items, which are available for download by anyone who cares to get them at www.thetrain.de

As to your 3d modelling efforts, use Google Sketchup. You can do ANYTHING with it except animations.

And even if you want to animate something, you can build it in Sketchup, then export it to *.s format, convert that *.s file into a *.3ds file and then proceed to animate it in gmax, and export it from gmax into *.s format again. Real simple.

[drelyea]

Hi,

This list is what I see might be in the way of being independent of MSTS, and is not inclusive:

1. X-tracks did not replace the 290 trackshapes that came with MSTS, it expanded around them. (Global Folder/Shapes) It also expanded around the roadshapes that came with MSTS

2. Besides the Shapes and Textures of static objects, I don't think anyone has replaced every TerrTex that came with MSTS. While many are not used often, some odd ones do creep in.

3. Unless the .sms file type is proprietary, just the .wav files would need to be replaced. I am also not volunteering on this, as the .wav files need to be looped. There are threads about this in the Sound Design Forum.

4. The Items in the ENV folder of the route would have to be checked against MSTS. While the ENV folder is normally standalone, the textures may have been copied. Examine the contents of the Template folder in the Train Sim root folder to see what can happen to a route. This is what MSTS uses to make a new Route from the RGE.

I'm not saying it can't be done. These are the items I see that would have to be reproduced/replaced to make something stand without the needed for MSTS.

If a route requires that the 6 default routes be installed, it will not stand alone, as this is a sign it has a .bat that will copy things out of those routes. If a route is of "Standard gauge", ie it uses the A1t100mstrt, and/or the A1t10mstrt, it will also not stand alone.

Even something that installs as a mini-route is likely to contain something that came from the default MSTS setup, in any or all of these areas.

Doug Relyea

[kox]

wav files should be replaced anyways, since OR supports better sound quality than MSTS did. However the pitching of sounds in sms files are done by exact frequencies, which i don't know how OR handles, but it's very easy to convert to frequency independent pitch values.

[OTTODAD]

Below is something else about MSTS default vegetation that needs to be replaced with 3D equivalents.

In forests they show only 2 planes crossed.

Tracks ? DB-Tracks could be used, converting X-Tracks in routes World files, but at the moment not all X-Tracks have DB-Tracks versions, I am sure Norbert is working on.

I am using RailWaves track joints sounds which are not audible in ORTS other that when using the #5 Passenger view inside carriages and neither can the default track joint sounds be heard either, nor my going over points one in sound sources.

O t t o

[seagoon]

..... Real simple.

For those who are interested in this type of creative activity, certainly.
But not all of we train-simmers are attracted to that side of the hobby.

BK

[ragtimer]

Why are route builders now not using either Marc's scale rail system or DB tracks instead of burdening their route with clunky old too wide rails?This would be an advance for either OR or MSTS.Is it more difficult to use either of these systems in the first place?