BVE: CSV - B3D converter

[smace]

I have created a CSV-> B3D converter. I know there is a B3D -> CSV converter from Mackoy (I have it). What I needed was something to take the newer CSV objects and put them to B3D for Route Builder.
I have finished the first cut beta version and need a couple of testers. I would perfer some one with Route builder, to see if the conversions work there, but anyone is welcome. Send me a PM or email and I will email you a copy.
NOTE IMPORTANT: Email mush have BVE Converter in subject to get through the email filters. If not, I may miss the message.
Operating notes:
Final version sould convert both ways, but the B3D -> CSV part is not turned on in this version.
Newer versions of BVE and RB work with Cube and Cylinder and Translate and Rotate command in CSV and B3d,(see the RB Bugs and wishes section on RB site), but I do not know if older versions do.
To make this work with RB, a dummy face is built. Current dummy face is fixed in place, although if this version works, I will try to make the dummy faces exist where the complex faces (cube,ect) are.
I have tested this in Win 98, and am looking for other OS's also.
And for those who might ask, why do this here rather than in the RB formun? Because this one is a bit more active at the moment.

[Tim Frost]

RE: CSV - B3D converter

I'd be glad to test such a utility.

I'm not sure what you mean about the cube and cylinder commands... do they go from CSV ---> b3d just fine or is something put in their place?

If you'd like to email the program, you may do so to tim@nvta.co.uk

Tim Frost
NVTA Subway routes for BVE:

http://nvta.co.uk

http://nvta.free-hosting.org.uk/images/tsimnvtaavatar.jpg

[ferrovipathe]

RE: CSV - B3D converter

I'd be glad too to test your utility, on W98 and XP.

As you know, Loop route is in .RW and objects in b3d.

I don't use csv, because it is an Excel format, and I am now an old timer programmer. I prefers readable sources on paper instead of sources with billion of comma.

But, as I test few monts ago, we may mix B3D and CSV objects in the same route,(.rw or .csv) without problems.
It seems BVE is able to use B3D and CSV objects in the same route.

As .b3d objects are always smaller than .csv, and as BVE's loading and computing time is depended of source's lenght, your utility is very welcomed for that.

All the best.

Jean-Louis.coste@nck.ap-hop-paris.fr

[smace]

RE: CSV - B3D converter

>I'm not sure what you mean about the cube and cylinder commands... do they go from CSV ---> b3d just fine or is something put in their place?

The Cube and Cylinder commands work in BVE in B3D format very well, atleast n the current versions .There is a list of the conversions on the RB forum, and I used that to do the conversions. What does not work well is RB dealing with these commands, so I had to put a small fudge in the conversion for RB to be able to read these commands and build a bounding box. RB will insert these complex command objects with out the fudge, but you can not see where they are in RB. Makes placement difficult.

[Routemaster J]

RE: CSV - B3D converter

I am sorry but I don't think this is a good idea at all. What you are doing is producing an easy way for people to rip off others work by converting grat objects in csv to b3d to use in RouteBuilder! It is a bad idea, and is only useful to those with malicious intent. You see most detailed and new objects are in csv format, and those using RouteBuilder can't get thier grubby little hands on them (no offence to any one just a phrase!), but this way it is much easier for the likes of Anas, and similar people like him to rip off our work.

You see the b3d to csv converter is a useful utility as it allows you to upgrade!

[etjason]

RE: CSV - B3D converter

Thats true But!!

If do use route builder to make a route and do run it thru the program to produce an output, There is nothing to stop anyone from running the file into a text editor and linking in the csv objects anyway into a route since BVE need to be in CSV format anyway. It only takes one command and the proper path names to put an object in a route reguardless if it's dome by Routebuilder or by hand. Anyone can reverse the process anyway. PS There was already a chart put out a long time ago to convert CSV and B3D objects.

And what happens if the route builder people puts one out for route builder. I know there are certain things you can't do directly thru routebuilder I thought they said things like taking other objects was out. I think they are stored differently.

Maybe the program may used for good too.

Jason

[Anthony_B]

RE: CSV - B3D converter

Do the resulting B3D files retain the author headers that might be inserted into the original CSV objects by the original developer, or does the utility skip over comments and ommit them from the B3D file? If it strips them out could you possibly ensure the utility preserves these headers?

Thanks.

Anthony.
--

https://www.railsimroutes.co.uk

https://www.bvetrains.co.uk

https://www.railsimroutes.co.uk/bvehelp/

[Tim Frost]

RE: CSV - B3D converter

Actually I see plenty of use for this on my own. I DESPISE working in csv for object building for many reasons. I don't encounter CSV object very often, but the default uchibo poles (which I have modified for use with my routes) are in CSV and I converted them to b3d to make them workable.

I don't use routebuilder, either.

While this program could be seen with malintent I see plenty of use for such a program just for someone like me. On some occasions I also return my objects from b3d --> csv format before I use them in my routes.

While I see your point, not EVERYONE has malicious intent for everything.

Tim Frost
NVTA Subway routes for BVE:

http://nvta.co.uk

http://nvta.free-hosting.org.uk/images/tsimnvtaavatar.jpg

[smace]

RE: CSV - B3D converter

First, thank you for the responces, I have enough testers.

Second I am following the discussion with interest. The program preserves all ; type headers and lines with no changes, and adds a couple of its own.
Intellectual property theft is a concern of mine too. I will take any suggestions on how to deal with this digital signatures, hidden text, what ever. I wrote this mostly for my use, and it works for me, so I would even consider not doing a public release if that is what the community thinks is best. (And please do not start a flame war on this, that has already killed one good resourse). In one of the RB forums or discussions or Info page there is an indication that RB will eventually have native CSV support. And if you have the patience and Excell or Word oor even word pad, you can do a text substitution

[Uwe Post]

RE: CSV - B3D converter

You shouldn't even sell computers, because somebody could develop a computer virus with it! Come on ...

RB will have native csv support sometime in the future.
Maybe smace and the RB dev team will work together on this, we are already discussing this.

Meanwhile, the converter could be helpful for everybody who wants to use his own or foreign csv objects with RB. The developer guidelines state clearly that you must seek permission to use other people's objects if they are not OpenSource and so on. If you do, you may use such objects and it would be great if they could be used with RB, too.
Thus I think the converter should of course be published when the beta test has been completed.

A very helpful tool shouldn't be cancelled just because somebody could do any harm using it.

Uwe

[Wulf_9]

RE: CSV - B3D converter

Hear hear Uwe,

A voice of reason in the mist

It is not the fault of a thing if a person misuses it, the intent is what counts.

Josh I hope this rationale placates your worries

Ciao

Saxon Locomotive Works - "The difficult we do immediately; the impossible takes a little longer"

http://www.zodiac-infosystems.co.uk/rail/bve

[leezer3]

RE: CSV - B3D converter

>I will take any suggestions on how to deal with this digital signatures, hidden text, what ever.

How about a dummy vertex or face? You could then use the vertex numbers as a developer ID.

Chris Lees

http://bvecornwall.cjb.net -BVE Cornwall: Providing QUALITY Steam for BVE!

[Routemaster J]

RE: CSV - B3D converter

I suppose that if the object headers are not removed then it will be ok! As long as the program is used for good things which I am sure it will by the majority of users, Then I am happy. Still checks as always must be made on new routes to see what objects have been used.

Is there no way to put a developer ID that cant be removed in these files?

Another thing I suppose and object library is required with a greater choice of general objects so then there would be no need to use others...?

[smace]

RE: CSV - B3D converter


>
>Is there no way to put a developer ID that cant be removed
>in these files?

Maybe. The thing is that the files are plain text files. It is difficult to hide thing in those files, but there may be ways. For instance a US social security number is 9 digits. Assumn a number of 123-45-6789

In a set of Vertex like:
Vertex -4.9, 1.5, 0
Vertex -4.9, 0, 0
Vertex 0, 0, 0
Vertex 0, 1.5, 0
VERTEX 1,2,3 <-DUMMY VERTEX. Alwas these three together
VERTEX 4,5,6 <-DUMMY VERTEX. do not use as a face.
VERTEX 7,8,9 <-DUMMY VERTEX
Vertex -4.9, 1.4, -0.2
Vertex -4.9, 0, -0.2
Vertex 0, 0, -0.2
Vertex 0, 1.4, -0.2

In a large file always put in something like this.( or use .1 .2 or what ever, just the same in each file) Each developer uses some private unique signature. Most pirates are not going to take the time to examine every vertex.

>Another thing I suppose and object library is required with
>a greater choice of general objects so then there would be
>no need to use others...?

Was there someone who was doing this. I think I saw a mention on Crotrainz about something like this, or was it a mis type by someone?

[Routemaster J]

RE: CSV - B3D converter

Theres an idea! (why dont we have a light bulb smiley?)